Hasbeen, I would love you to write a book. As an automotive historian, I have to say your stuff is pure gold. There is so little of this kind of real first person recollection stuff out there. And, Mark, this has turned out to be one of the best threads yet seen on Shannons Club. Every time I shelve Bill Tuckey's history of the great race, I seem to have to get it down again. He did have the occasional error in his copy but I don't doubt these times for the 1967 and 1968 races. The fastest race lap by a Mini in 1967 3:8.5 with the Falcons on 3:02 and Alfas 3:03. The 1968 grid had McPhee on pole on 2:56.7. The fastest qualifying Falcon was the Geoghegan brothers on 2:59.8. Comparing those lap times with later ones (my own best was a 2:59 in 1992 in a Citroen BX 16-Valve) is difficult. Perhaps the Chase added four to six seconds for a production car, but the opening out of the corners and the better surface would doubtless have swallowed this up and perhaps rather more. An even more interesting comparison, I reckon is between the V8 Supercars and the GT3 cars. In the 2011 race the Audi R8 was some 25 km/h slower down Conrod and much slower up the hill and yet lapped in similar times to the 'Falcons' and 'Commodores'. AS far as I recall back in the 1960s and 1970s no-one ever talked about downforce. The GT3s are pricey but at least they are real cars which wealthy customers can buy. This looks like the real future of this category. (it is interesting to compare this cornering attitude with that of the Vauxhall Viva. This little car had such roll angles that in at least one case the car fell over all by itself. Is there anyone left on the plant who doesn't believe that racing improves the breed? Speak now...